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Face the Nation

News/Business. (2013) Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.); Rep. Mike Rogers (R-Mich.); Gen. Michael Hayden. New. (CC) (Stereo)

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00:31:00

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TOPIC FREQUENCY

Nsa 7, Bob 7, Spiriva 5, Us 4, Pakistan 4, California 4, Edward Snowden 4, Washington 4, America 3, Germany 3, Copd 3, Tsa 2, Citi 2, Afghanistan 2, U.s. 2, Mike Rogers 2, Russia 2, Diane 2, Lansing 1, Ge 1,
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  CBS    Face the Nation    News/Business.  (2013) Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.);  
   Rep. Mike Rogers (R-Mich.); Gen. Michael Hayden. New. (CC)...  

    November 3, 2013
    8:30 - 9:01am PST  

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michael hayden who ran the national security agency when some of our allies phones were attacked. we'll get analysis from david ignatious of the "washington post," david sanger of the "new york times." cbs news chief legal correspondent jan crawford and cbs news political director john dickerson. as we approach the 50th anniversary of the kennedy assassination we'll talk to former "life" magazine editor dick stolen and granddaughter of abe da bra ma'am zaputa it's a lot but that's what we do at "face the nation." >> schieffer: good morning again we welcome to the broadcast the chairman of the senate intelligence committee california senator diane feinstein. thank you so much, senator, for coming. you have been a big defender from the beginning of the
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national security agency but you were clearly upset with the revelation that we were tapping german chancellor angla merkel's cell phone, you said it was a big problem that the empty was unaware. do you believe that that the president didn't know this was happening? >> i can't answer that. i don't know. but i think where allies are close tapping private phones of their's particularly of the leader, the leader is what i'm talking about has much more political liability than probably intelligence viability. and i think we ought to look at it carefully. i believe the president is doing that and there are some exceptions. >> schieffer: do you think that the national security agency has gone too far? >> well, let me say something about the nsa. i believe the nsa is filled with good patriotic people who want
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to do the right thing. they follow the orders they're given. the administration controls intelligence. the national intelligence framework is put together by the administration. it begins with the director of national intelligence, it goes to the white house, it's the president, it's the nsc the cabinet and then the framework is formed. now, what happens is, people add to it, state wants this, department of state wants to know this. or somebody else wants to know that. priorities are ranked. as i understand it these are the priorities. one, terrorism. two, support of our military abroad. three, nuclear counter proliferation. four, hard targets. and now cyber. and those are the main areas. so essentially the nsa is told to do certain things and it does it. what i think we need to do, we
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work very well with the house committee and leadership, mike rogers and congressman rupersberger is review of the intelligence framework of how all this gets together. what the criteria for inclusion are. then we ought to take a look at all the programs that fall under this because it's not just the metadata collection program which is section 1215. and 702 which is the e-mail program from afar. that's been the big news up to now. these are other programs that are formed in different ways under -- >> schieffer: what you're saying is a full review then decide where we go from there. >> yes. the white house is doing it. and we're going to begin it if we can get the appropriate staff. >> schieffer: let me ask you about this. a german politics actually
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visited with edward snowden who dumped all of this information out in to the public arena. met with him last week in russia. he said he would try to enlist his help to investigate the nsa and suggested that he be brought back to this country and given clemency. what would be your reaction to that? >> my reaction would be negative. first of all, this is an american, he was a contractor he was tested. he stripped our system, he had an opportunity if what he was was a whistle blower to pick up the phone to call the house intelligence committee, the senate intelligence committee and say, look, i have some information you ought to see. and we would certainly see him. maybe both together, maybe separately but we would have seen him and we would have looked at that information. that didn't happen.
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and now he's done this enormous disservice to our country. and i think the answer is, no clemency. >> schieffer: in other words, if the united states could get their hands on him you would suggest that he be prosecuted. >> that's correct. >> schieffer: let me shift to the roll out of obamacare. this thing seems to be a disaster. it's nothing like the administration said it was going to be. so many things that were supposed to happen didn't happen. where are we on this? >> i think where we are is the divide between policy and technology. it's pretty clear i think to those of us that have been watching this roll out that the technological base was not sufficient. and that the website didn't function. i felt, and i said this directly to the president's chief of staff, they ought to take down
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the website until it was right. they believe they need to keep it running that and they can sort out of difficulties that they brought in technological experts from a broad base of the private sector that by the end of november it can be sorted out. and be functioning properly. i don't think there's ever been any website started to do what this website does in the size of this one. i don't make excuse but i think that is pretty much fact of what's happened. >> schieffer: the president said in the beginning that one thing was that if you like the health care program you had you could keep it. we now know there was debate within the administration before he said that as to whether that was actually a promise that could be kept. should the president not have made that statement? >> well, as i understand it you can keep it up to the time, i hope this is correct, but this is what i've been told, up to
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the time the bill was enacted. then after that it's a different story. i think that part of it, if true, was never made clear. it is really very unclear right now exactly what the situation is. and, yes, that's a problem. but i think it has to be said. this is a very large major priority and if it can get up and running, it can be, i think, a very positive thing. the big problem here is there are so many destroyers. in the house, in the public, in the private health care sector that just want to destroy. that's not helpful. >> schieffer: i take your point. but the fact is the thing doesn't work. >> the fact is there's a problem with the startup. i won't go so far right now as to say the plan isn't going to work. once it gets started up. >> schieffer: let me ask you
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one other thing, quickly, a man walked in to the los angeles airport friday, opened fire on tsa officials with an assault weapon. does this put more pressure on you to revive your efforts to get another assault weapons ban for congress or is that dead? >> well, let me just first of all say, because this happened in california, it happened in my constituents. i have some wounded and dead constituents. let me just pay tribute to tsa agent hernandez. a father of two children, with a wife, shot point blank at his station doing work he believed in and to me is a very, very special person. so to, all of those, my deepest sorrow. having said that, the weapon was a .223 mp15, the mp stands for
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military and police. clearly designed not for general consumption. but through practice now general consumption. same gun that was used at aurora. i'm sure i would do a bill, i mean i believe this down deep in my -- bjorn borg do you think there is any way that such a bill could pass? >> no, i don't. i think there's a hammer lock on the congress by the gun owners and gun people and it doesn't matter. now, it's going to be interesting to see whether this weapon was outlawed in california and whether it was purchased in california. >> schieffer: all right. senator, thank you so much. >> you're very welcome, bob. >> schieffer: now to lansing, michigan, the chairman of the house intelligence committee, mike rogers. congressman, what about this idea, you heard what senator feinstein said about granting clemency to edward snowden and bringing him back to help
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investigate the national security agency. >> well, the only investigation here is to what extent he knew about the material that he stole and who else he worked with. certainly the russians are not allowing him to stay in the country of russia because they think he's just a nice guy there. is clearly more to this story. i think that is a -- if he wants to come back and open up to the responsibility of the fact that he took and stole information, he violated his oath, he disclosed classified information, that by the way has allowed three different terrorist organization, affiliates of al qaeda to change the way they communicate, i'd be happy to have that discussion with him. but he does need to own up with what he's done. if he wants to talk through why he did it those things that would be the appropriate time and the appropriate way to do it. >> schieffer: you would not be willing to give him any kind of clemency, i take it? >> no. i don't see any reason. i wouldn't do that.
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he needs to come back and own up, we can have those conversations if he believes there's vulnerabilities in the system he'd like to disclose you don't do it by committing a crime that puts soldiers' lives at risk in places like afghanistan you don't do that. somehow harrison card here. >> schieffer: with every revelation more pressure to reign in the nsa. do you think that needs to be done? >> you know, this is at the whole problem. we focused a lot on the nsa, bob, but not a lot about what the threat s. you think about the programs all which are legal have the most oversight of any programs in the united states government. it's happened under when the democrats control the congress, when the republicans control the congress, when a republican controlled the white house, when a democrat controlled the white house. the question now isn't how you reign in the nsa, the object, are they following the law, are they protecting civil ribber -- liberties that's what the oversight committees do.
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i work well in that function of oversight. the question is, what are the threats to the united states. who is using u.s. networks right now to steal intellectual property like the chinese, the russians and others. we've had cyberattacks against the united states this year from a nation state that exceeds over 300 different 'teams destroy some financial services networks that affects every american. we haven't talked about those things. we've got al qaeda spreading around the world in a way that is frightening, think about it. last year alone some 15,000 terrorist-related deaths. it is the nsa, the cia and others charge to make sure that zero of them happen here. zero. that's our standard. and so what we've asked hem to do is go out and collect information that protects america so every politician in washington, both republican and democrat are seized up by this hyper partisanship can't wait to put out a press release how terrible our intelligence
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service are. it's a deer caught in the headlights how he deals with what all of us have done very careful work both republicans and democrats to oversee engaging in the activities that protect american. >> schieffer: do you take him at his word when he says that that we're told he didn't know about, for example, that we were eve dropping on the german chancellor's cell phone, could that that be right? >> i think there going to be some best actor awards coming out of the white house this year. best supporting actor awards out of the european union. this is a bit shocking to me that folks who are actively engaged in espionage efforts around the world, that is a french word, after all. some notion that there is this big mystery under all of these years that some people just didn't have an understanding about how we collect information to protect the united states. to me is wrong. unfortunately that -- all of
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this is that victim of this hyper partisanship where people can't wait to get out in front of the cameras and say, boy, i sure don't like those intelligence services. here is the problem, bob. we did this in the 1930s. we turned it off 1929, secretary of state at that time where they were collecting information to proceed america said, we shouldn't do this, this is unseemly. turned it off. that led to a whole bunch of misunderstanding that led to world war ii that killed millions of people. we did the same darn thing leading up to the osama bin laden effort where we didn't want to talk, didn't coordinate, didn't want to get certain things it led to 9/11. that took the lives of 3,000 americans. we learned a valuable lesson. need to focus on the bad guys, they are not u.s. intelligence agencies. u9q good guys at the end of the day. >> schieffer: let me ask you about one of the alleged bad guys which we apparently killed last week during a drone strike in pakistan. was this a big deal?
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>> it was a big deal. i'll tell you why it happened. by the way all of those intelligence agencies, i mean all of them that people of both parties decided are bad, contributed to leading up to what is a very difficult, long term collection of all sources of intelligence to make sure you can find an individual and do something about it. reason this guy is a bad guy, in p 2007 he brought together all of the pakistan, taliban, wanted to focus on at that time the pakistani military but also made threats to the night states, especially masud who said, we're going to conduct operations in the united states there's a relationship between the gentleman that showed up in times square in the individual that was taken off the battlefield here very -- not a long time ago. this is the guy that is trying to create the problems both for pakistan, he relates with afghanistan taliban, these are the folks that close 500 schools, most of them girls'
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schools in the eastern provinces of afghanistan. he's part of the hakani network which is basically a giant organized crime group operating in the tribal areas of pakistan who have been involved in supporting al qaeda. taliban and others. this was a bad guy, by the way there's some information recently that concerned us about the safety of our troops. i feel a little better for our troops today than i did before this event happened. remember, this is the world we live in, bob, that's what's so frustrating for diane and myself. we're dealing with these threats every single day. they are big, they are real, they affect real people. i'll tell you we should protect our soldiers in the field and we should also protect their families who are here back in the united states, we should use every means that is legal, protect civil liberties and gets the job done that's what we're doing. that's the conversation i think we should be everything. >> schieffer: let me ask you one final question about the rollout of obama care. you came down very hard on hhs,
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dr. sebelius when she came before congress last week. you said that what disturbed you most of all was that people were feeding in to this website vital information about themselves. you were very concerned about the security of that information that it was now just out there for people to take. are you satisfied yet that this has been corrected or will be corrected? >> well, no. what was really shocking to me is even by their own words they admitted that there was a high degree of risk when they were offering the website to go public, they never told anybody about that. they said that they think the risk was acceptable. their information wasn't at risk, american people's information was at risk. they're trying to change a tire on a car going 75 miles an hour down the expressway. that is not the way cybersecurity works. and unfortunately both diane and
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i both know the real threats to these systems when you have nation states, organized crime groups and criminals trying to get information that is now available on these websites. they need to take the site down, stabilize it meaning they can't ton add code every week. and then they need to stress test the system. unfortunately, bob, none of that has happened they admit it's going to take six months. that is unacceptable for the protection of privacy of americans' information. >> schieffer: i'm sorry we have to leave it there. thank you so much, mr. chairman. back in a minute. >> thanks, bob. [ male announcer ] 1.21 gigawatts. today, that's easy. ge is revolutionizing power. supercharging turbines with advanced hardware and innovative software. using data predictively to help power entire cities. so the turbines of today... will power us all... into the future. ♪
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see who does good work and compare costs. it doesn't usually work that way with health care. but with unitedhealthcare, i get information on quality rated doctors, treatment options and estimates for how much i'll pay. that helps me, and my guys, make better decisions. i don't like guesses with my business, and definitely not with our health. innovations that work for you. that's health in numbers. unitedhealthcare. >> schieffer: war back with the former head of the national security agency and the cia, general michael haykden, do you spy on anla merkel. >> i can't comment on any leadership. the intentions were very high intelligence priorities for the life of the national security agency. it's nothing special it certainly nothing new. >> schieffer: could it be
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possible that the president didn't know about it if we were listening in on her cell phone? >> i think the president's statement at face value. i can imagine circumstances where he wouldn't. it's impossible for me to imagine that the nsc, the administration, the white house didn't know. and the fact that they didn't rush in to tell the president this was going on points out what i think is a fund menthol fact. >> schieffer: that is? >> this wasn't exceptional. this is what we were expect to do. >> schieffer: let me ask you this, if we stop spying on angleca merkel will the chinese also stand down their efforts? >> i don't think so. i know the chance already's embarrassed, we're a friend. this revelation put her in a very difficult political spot. that, bob, frankly in the world of espyian original the fact that the united states may have been intercepting her text messages is the least of the worries in berlin right now. >> schieffer: are they spying on us? >> who, the germans? i would just assume that almost
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all other nations in the world conduct espy i don't know madge. what we did as prudent mr. suffer defend ourselves. we had a grand debate about president obama's blackberry. the most powerful country on earth was don't use your blackberry. there are a lot of intelligence services who are going to try to intercept it. >> schieffer: the germans seem to think that edward snowden should be brought back to this country, either that or taken to germany and given a chance to help investigate the national security agency. what is i didn't reaction? >> first of all i would welcome edward snowden being brought back to this country. but i know one german parliamentarian is suggesting that germany give mr. snowden a platform to reveal more american secrets. my view on that, that would kind of tend to moot the whole debate here about whether or not we're spying on a friend. >> schieffer: i take it you do not, i've asked this, if you
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thought he was a hero i believe you said you thought he was a if he tech for. >> yes. >> schieffer: do you think there has been harm not just our intelligence gathering but also our influence by these revelations? >> absolutely. look, i understand the situation in germany now with the chancellor is embarrassed. but let's assume that this was discovered not through press accounts but through german counter intelligence. the last thing the germans would have done would have made this public. they would have come to us privately and we would have solved this problem. what this has done has destroyed, threatened, important relationships we have. >> schieffer: i'm sorry but we have to leave it there. thanks so much. we'll be back in a moment. i'll have some personal thoughts. t 40 years the united states population is going to grow by over 90 million people, and almost all that growth is going to be in cities. what's the healthiest and best way for them to grow so that they really become cauldrons of prosperity
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the republican shut down of the government, the phrase that kept running through my mind was worse and worser. is worser a word? well, actually, it is. we looked it up. the shutdown was the worst but this thing is worser. if we thought the partisan blather couldn't get thicker or sillier than it got during the shutdown, well, we now know. by now we have heard from all the people whose fault it wasn't. we've heard all the talking points and some of the critics were all but foaming at the mouth. it was the washington we have come to know. all talk, all the time, but at the end of the day just another example of how government seems incapable of making things better and it never seems to learn. does anyone believe that successful start-ups like amazon or google would risk launching their programs before they were properly tested? there may be a lesson there if those involved could spend less time refining the talking points
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and more time actually trying to make things work. the way this thing is going it is a good thing we have a word like worser. back in a minute. s hard. know the feeling? copd includes emphysema and chronic bronchitis. spiriva is a once-daily inhaled copd maintenance treatment that helps open my obstructed airways for a full 24 hours. spiriva helps me breathe easier. spiriva handihaler tiotropium bromide inhalation powder does not replace fast-acting inhalers for sudden symptoms. tell your doctor if you have kidney problems, glaucoma, trouble urinating, or an enlarged prostate. these may worsen with spiriva. discuss all medicines you take, even eye drops. stop taking spiriva and seek immediate medical help if your breathing suddenly worsens, your throat or tongue swells, you get hives, vision changes or eye pain, or problems passing urine. other side effects include dry mouth and constipation. nothing can reverse copd.
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spiriva helps me breathe better. does breathing with copd weigh you down? don't wait to ask your doctor about spiriva. >> schieffer: we'll be right back at you with more "face the nation." ,,,,,,
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>> all right, gentlemen, it's november and we all know what that means. it's time to work hard or go home. and i understand what november means to you. you're going to miss thanksgiving dinner. you're going to miss christmas dinner but we all have to make sacrifices and you are the greatest pregame show on television. why? because you're not afraid to sacrifice! bill: boom, who is this guy? boomer: i have no idea how he got in